Armchair Dragoons Forums

Wargaming => The Modern World => Topic started by: tuna on September 10, 2019, 08:18:28 PM

Title: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 10, 2019, 08:18:28 PM
Ordered Holland 44 today.. Thanks for all the pushing and prodding!  :bigthumb:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 10, 2019, 08:24:52 PM
Download the rules from GMT and start reading!
 :bigthumb:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Silent Disapproval Robot on September 10, 2019, 08:26:37 PM
Then we can play on VASSAL and try to forget that we just shelled out for physical copies (and fancy maps)!

Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 10, 2019, 08:46:44 PM
Ordered Holland 44 today.. Thanks for all the pushing and prodding!  :bigthumb:


Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: panzerde on September 10, 2019, 09:15:14 PM
Welcome to the club, Tuna!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bbmike on September 11, 2019, 06:12:15 AM
Welcome to the club, Tuna!

+1! Go ahead and order the extra shelves now.  :bigthumb:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 11, 2019, 06:21:43 AM
Its an excellent game, and a very good system - better start looking for copies of Normandy '44 and Ardennes '44 as well :-)
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 11, 2019, 06:28:38 AM
I've got that and Ardennes 44. Neither is even punched at the moment.

I did want Normandy 44 but it's just too big map wise.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 11, 2019, 07:21:09 AM
JD, Normandy '44 only has a single map - Ardennes '44 has 2 maps.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 11, 2019, 08:29:13 AM
I know Ardennes has but they fit (sort of with some manipulation) in my boardgame cover thingyamybob.

As for Normandy, I saw this and thought it was several maps

https://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/1175814/battle-normandy

Even if it's a single map, there's NOWHERE I could lay that bad boy out  :-\
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 11, 2019, 08:30:39 AM
Is that BIG map from the other box game he has showing there..."The Battle for Normandy"?

So is the Normandy '44 map the little one up the right of that image?


It IS!

I might actually pickup Normandy 44 now because it was that massive map that put me off
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 11, 2019, 09:15:24 AM
ONE of us, Tuna! :)

Holland '44 is a good-looking game. It's one of my many unpunched ones that I want to eventually get to!  :bigthumb:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bayonetbrant on September 11, 2019, 09:54:15 AM
ONE of us, Tuna! :)



(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQGjhiX3eL371O06QyrOfjlBbLrIh0PV70vBfCCJj8kotzzK3iB)
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 11, 2019, 10:06:23 AM
it was that massive map that put me off

I like big maps and I can not lie
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bayonetbrant on September 11, 2019, 10:13:09 AM
it was that massive map that put me off

I like big maps and I can not lie


will be surrounded by them 'til I die
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bbmike on September 11, 2019, 10:38:11 AM
it was that massive map that put me off

I like big maps and I can not lie


will be surrounded by them 'til I die

'cause the more they make the more I buy
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 11, 2019, 10:39:57 AM
it was that massive map that put me off

I like big maps and I can not lie

will be surrounded by them 'til I die

'cause the more they make the more I buy

"Don't buy more games?" I say "fie"
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Bison on September 11, 2019, 03:49:20 PM
Great game series. I need GMT to reprint France 40 to round out the collection.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 11, 2019, 04:11:31 PM
Stalingrad '42 is in the works................

https://www.gmtgames.com/p-715-stalingrad-42.aspx
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 11, 2019, 04:16:31 PM
Stalingrad '42 is in the works................

https://www.gmtgames.com/p-715-stalingrad-42.aspx

Whoa, it's at the printer. Nice! This is one of my P500 orders...the other being Mr. President.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 11, 2019, 04:20:47 PM
Stalingrad '42 is in the works................

https://www.gmtgames.com/p-715-stalingrad-42.aspx (https://www.gmtgames.com/p-715-stalingrad-42.aspx)

That's a must buy. I like the scope and the maps look awesome.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 11, 2019, 04:21:39 PM
Great game series. I need GMT to reprint France 40 to round out the collection.

I'll have to dig out my copy and clip the counters
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Bison on September 11, 2019, 05:15:57 PM
I’d forgot about Stalingrad 42.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 11, 2019, 05:27:48 PM
You'd need one big ass table for that one!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 11, 2019, 05:33:50 PM
I’d forgot about Stalingrad 42.

Just as well I jogged your memory then, innit?  :D
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 11, 2019, 05:42:07 PM
Download the rules from GMT and start reading!
 :bigthumb:

Not to forget this:
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/gmtwebsiteassets/Holland44/Holland44+Errata_Nov27-2017.pdf
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bayonetbrant on September 11, 2019, 05:52:34 PM
Stalingrad '42 is in the works................

https://www.gmtgames.com/p-715-stalingrad-42.aspx (https://www.gmtgames.com/p-715-stalingrad-42.aspx)


That's awesome, I love it when designers tackle under-represented topics.

Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 11, 2019, 05:56:03 PM
Whilst on one hand, I agree with you; I would point out that, if you are familiar with the system, you will recognise that no previous game on the subject (that I'm aware of) has represented it in quite this way.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Bison on September 11, 2019, 05:59:21 PM
I would like to see some North Africa and Italian campaigns. A good Burma campaign would be interesting too. But I like the series and Stalingrad is a must campaign for any WW2 series IMO.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Bison on September 11, 2019, 06:01:25 PM
I’d forgot about Stalingrad 42.

Just as well I jogged your memory then, innit?  :D

Quite.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 11, 2019, 06:03:14 PM
Yep - I would like to see the system transported to NA.

Few games exist about the Burma campaign - but there is one in the OCS games from MMP,:

https://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/1585/burma
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bayonetbrant on September 11, 2019, 06:15:39 PM
Whilst on one hand, I agree with you; I would point out that, if you are familiar with the system, you will recognise that no previous game on the subject (that I'm aware of) has represented it in quite this way.


You're probably right, I'm just in a mood right now because there are too many idiots in this town where I live
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 11, 2019, 07:22:57 PM
Any good videos of the Combat system basics, even if from another series (is it sort of the same on all of them)?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 12, 2019, 01:53:55 AM
I haven't watched this yet, but it's in my list. Maybe it'll help



Jesus...I've just watched this guy for 5 minutes and he lost 3 bridges that he approached (rolls of 6 each time!!) Unlucky or what.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 12, 2019, 06:18:24 AM
Yep - it can happen.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 12, 2019, 09:47:57 AM
Really want to play Holland '44, but think I'll wait for Stalingrad '42 to learn the system. I've been anticipating S'42 for a while now but damn, H'44 looks awful purty...

Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 12, 2019, 10:03:04 AM
Any good videos of the Combat system basics, even if from another series (is it sort of the same on all of them)?

There are a few on youtube, and yes, the basic system is the same for all the games.

Its probably worth downloading the Vassal mod as well. I've played it a bit on Vassal and its a well done mod.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 12, 2019, 11:14:12 AM
We should get a multiplayer game going.
Allies are easy to break into sections - British/Polish Airborne, XXXCorps, 82nd Airborne, 101st Airborne.
Germans might be a bit harder - maybe defenses against each of the Allies sections.
Could even go one further and make it all double blind with a Ref... I'd be willing to ref.

Could be fun.
 
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 12, 2019, 11:15:29 AM
Hmm. Worth thinking about  :bigthumb:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 12, 2019, 12:54:57 PM
Interesting. As long as there's no weak-ass French cavalry involved, I'd be interested.

Are you talking VASSAL or TTS?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 12, 2019, 01:21:52 PM
I don't have TTS, but I do have Vassal. I'm not sure if there is a TTS mod?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 12, 2019, 01:29:37 PM
VASSAL. We could do it PBEM.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 12, 2019, 01:32:00 PM
I don't have TTS, but I do have Vassal. I'm not sure if there is a TTS mod?

Heh, good point, guess I could have looked that up myself...  ;D

There are some GMT games for TTS, but I don't see Holland '44.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 12, 2019, 01:46:55 PM
VASSAL. We could do it PBEM.

Very true. First, we need for people to get a grasp on the rules.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Silent Disapproval Robot on September 12, 2019, 02:07:58 PM
Rules?  Pffft...we don't need those.  I get to be Michael Caine!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 12, 2019, 02:26:53 PM
Playing this way is actually easier to learn the rules because you only need to know what directly affects your sector of the map.

I'm involved in a MP PBEM game of Bloody April that being run this way. I have control of one flight and that's all I have to worry about for the rules. The Ref is handling all the game mechanics so I just need to know how to fly and fight.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 12, 2019, 02:55:25 PM
.................you was only supposed to blow the bloody bridge up.....................
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 12, 2019, 03:17:59 PM
Any good videos of the Combat system basics, even if from another series (is it sort of the same on all of them)?

There are a few on youtube, and yes, the basic system is the same for all the games.

Its probably worth downloading the Vassal mod as well. I've played it a bit on Vassal and its a well done mod.

I've watched a few, but none that I've seen so far actually 'explain' the combat system for a total noob. That's why I was wondering if there was one that did that, that CRT table looks like Russian to me!

Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 12, 2019, 03:18:48 PM
Interesting. As long as there's no weak-ass French cavalry involved, I'd be interested.

Are you talking VASSAL or TTS?

TTS SNF!!!.. I don't know of any mod for TTS.. is there one?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 12, 2019, 03:33:53 PM
Well maybe I'll finally have to learn how to make a TTS module....  :doh:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 12, 2019, 03:39:26 PM
Well maybe I'll finally have to learn how to make a TTS module....  :doh:

Too bad more of these companies didn't make 'official' versions.. the Scythe one is awesome!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 15, 2019, 05:59:13 AM
I'm finding the ZOC and ZOC bonds rather confusing
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 15, 2019, 06:30:33 AM
I'm finding the ZOC and ZOC bonds rather confusing

That is the most difficult thing to grasp in this game, at least for me. They are different enough from other games that it’s hard for it to stick in my mind.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 07:45:29 AM
I'm finding the ZOC and ZOC bonds rather confusing

That is the most difficult thing to grasp in this game, at least for me. They are different enough from other games that it’s hard for it to stick in my mind.

From the PDF, I'm the whole thing confusing!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 09:56:00 AM
I'm finding the ZOC and ZOC bonds rather confusing

ZoCs are one of those things I can't keep straight from one game to another - do I pay moving in? moving out? both? can I move zoc to zoc? How does supply work through ZoCs?

Every game has a slightly different way of implementing them and it's a PITA to keep the rules straight in my brain.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 12:40:55 PM
lol, it 'arrived' on Friday, still have not opened it yet, I'm too scared! Maybe it will be like one of those games I bought in a Steam Sale, you know, never gets played.  :2funny:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 15, 2019, 01:19:30 PM
I've punched mine and clipped the corners. Now I've just got to go through the rules and book the table for a month 😂
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bbmike on September 15, 2019, 01:34:17 PM
lol, it 'arrived' on Friday, still have not opened it yet, I'm too scared! Maybe it will be like one of those games I bought in a Steam Sale, you know, never gets played.  :2funny:

You do know you're not actually supposed to play these games...
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 01:35:40 PM
You guys have encouraged me to clip my copy

(https://i.imgur.com/OF8uYbV.jpg)
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 15, 2019, 01:36:49 PM
Lovely :-)

Mind you, Normandy '44 is an exceptionally good game, IMHO.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 01:38:39 PM
lol, it 'arrived' on Friday, still have not opened it yet, I'm too scared! Maybe it will be like one of those games I bought in a Steam Sale, you know, never gets played.  :2funny:

You do know you're not actually supposed to play these games...


(https://media1.tenor.com/images/e5fe1e3b040779761983fa43152e2e5c/tenor.gif?itemid=9789067)
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 02:36:00 PM
You guys have encouraged me to clip my copy

(https://i.imgur.com/OF8uYbV.jpg)

send it to me when you're done, and I'll send you mine! :P
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 15, 2019, 02:44:38 PM
You wouldn't say that if you knew how much he charges per clip...............
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: trailrunner on September 15, 2019, 03:00:40 PM
You guys have encouraged me to clip my copy

(https://i.imgur.com/OF8uYbV.jpg)

What is the radius of your clipper?  2.5 or 3mm?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 15, 2019, 03:06:17 PM
You guys so winding "you know who" up by reposting clipped counters.

As for Normandy '44, it's selling for way too much. There's only 3 sellers on BGG. I contacted a Spanish guy on BGG because he was selling his for 45 euros, but he's not got back to me. Other than him, I see it for £300+ around.

It's available for P500 for $50, but it's not ready and pairing would be a huge amount from GMT. I would like to buy it as I have Ardennes and Holland
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 03:09:05 PM
What is the radius of your clipper?  2.5 or 3mm?
2.5
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 03:17:07 PM
You guys have encouraged me to clip my copy



What is the radius of your clipper?  2.5 or 3mm?

What do you mean? African or European clips?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 03:19:31 PM
You wouldn't say that if you knew how much he charges per clip...............

I could have been a heckuva mohel
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 15, 2019, 03:28:52 PM
You guys so winding "you know who" up by reposting clipped counters.

As for Normandy '44, it's selling for way too much. There's only 3 sellers on BGG. I contacted a Spanish guy on BGG because he was selling his for 45 euros, but he's not got back to me. Other than him, I see it for £300+ around.

It's available for P500 for $50, but it's not ready and pairing would be a huge amount from GMT. I would like to buy it as I have Ardennes and Holland

Wargamers European Market Place - this is a FB group - although I know a lot of people won't use FB -  but just thought I'd mention it.

And its worth checking here;
http://talk.consimworld.com/WebX?8@@.1dd37ede
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 04:03:15 PM
I got Bawb yelling at me on Steam!  :bigthumb:

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48739298587_31feb76efd_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2hfVDqg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48739118221_a8da35bf9b_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2hfUHNv)
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 15, 2019, 04:04:56 PM
 :whistle:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bayonetbrant on September 15, 2019, 04:12:26 PM
it's not like you don't have time during Pats-'Fins to work on punching & sorting the game
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 15, 2019, 04:16:50 PM
....and reading the rules...................
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 04:29:45 PM
But the box is way over there!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 04:32:49 PM
it's not like you don't have time during Pats-'Fins to work on punching & sorting the game
Pats-Finns? Is that something new from Compass?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 04:58:02 PM
Jeez now Amazon's sending me emails about Ardennes 44!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 05:13:03 PM
Jeez now Amazon's sending me emails about Ardennes 44!
Welcome to my world
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 15, 2019, 05:19:42 PM
Mwhahahaha!

Still not sure which I prefer; Ardennes '44 or Bitter Woods.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 15, 2019, 05:52:03 PM
it's not like you don't have time during Pats-'Fins to work on punching & sorting the game
Pats-Finns? Is that something new from Compass?

"something... something... Karelian Peninsula... something... "
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: trailrunner on September 15, 2019, 06:29:12 PM
What is the radius of your clipper?  2.5 or 3mm?
2.5

I knew yours was bigger than mine.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 15, 2019, 08:56:13 PM
What is the radius of your clipper?  2.5 or 3mm?
2.5

I knew yours was bigger than mine.

TMI
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 08:59:05 PM
What is the radius of your clipper?  2.5 or 3mm?
2.5

I knew yours was bigger than mine.

I'm seriously considering by the 2mm and 3mm just to round out my collection.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bbmike on September 15, 2019, 09:03:10 PM
You should ask Barthheart which one he recommends.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: trailrunner on September 15, 2019, 09:06:17 PM
I like my 2mm.  I've used it on 1/2 inch and 5/8 inch counters.  What would you use the 3mm for?  That seems big.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 09:11:18 PM
I like my 2mm.  I've used it on 1/2 inch and 5/8 inch counters.  What would you use the 3mm for?  That seems big.

I can only guess on some of the large counters. For the standard half-inch or 3/4 inch counter, the 2.5mm trimmer is fine.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 15, 2019, 09:34:01 PM
You should ask Barthheart which one he recommends.

0 mm....  :waiting:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 15, 2019, 09:37:21 PM
LOL

The 3mm is just fine, even with smaller/older counters.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 15, 2019, 10:32:08 PM
My solution: Buy all three sizes. Then keep the clippers in their packaging because, you know, the games are all still sealed.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 15, 2019, 10:41:30 PM
LOL

The 3mm is just fine, even with smaller/older counters.

that's what she said
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bayonetbrant on September 16, 2019, 06:01:22 AM
My solution: Buy all three sizes. Then keep the clippers in their packaging because, you know, the games are all still sealed.


 :hehe:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 16, 2019, 06:32:38 AM
What is the radius of your clipper?  2.5 or 3mm?
2.5

I knew yours was bigger than mine.

I'm seriously considering by the 2mm and 3mm just to round out my collection.

I saw what you did there!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 16, 2019, 09:22:47 AM
LOL

The 3mm is just fine, even with smaller/older counters.

that's what she said

as soon as I typed that I knew it would invite input from the peanut gallery

Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 16, 2019, 11:14:59 AM
I'll have to give up on my Normandy '44...that Spanish guy on BGG isn't answering.

I'll have to keep an eye out for when the third edition is almost ready.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 16, 2019, 11:23:35 AM
Did you look at those links I gave you?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 16, 2019, 11:37:16 AM
Sausage links?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bayonetbrant on September 16, 2019, 11:45:54 AM
Sausage links?


your first thought is always the sausage, innit?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 16, 2019, 12:14:50 PM
breakfast sausage, yes. Your el sicko reference, no.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 16, 2019, 03:17:41 PM
Did you look at those links I gave you?
I did but I thought I'd tripped back to 1980  :2funny:

The page was a mess. I wasn't sure what to do, but when I got to the page I searched for Normandy '44 and it didn't bring back anything (just the page mind).

I'll give it another look.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 16, 2019, 03:39:09 PM
Ah well, not to worry - I was just trying to help..................................you spend money :-)
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 16, 2019, 05:06:39 PM
Ah well, not to worry - I was just trying to help..................................you spend money :-)
I did go back and checked it out (not the FB one as I don't do FB).

There were some offers on there. The most recent (available and not so costly) was June/July 2018...I might get in touch with him - see if it's still available. There was an option there for $85 and more recent (this year) - but it is $85 and as all the costs are in $, it means there's going to be considerable postage costs.

Thanks for the links - I didn't say it before, but it should go without saying that any help was absolutely appreciated. I was just shocked at the consim page...it was like time travel  ;D

The one "possibly" available for last year was the 1st edition - I don't know that I want a 1st edition. I think I'll wait 'till the 3rd edition is out

Thank you all the same.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 16, 2019, 05:14:55 PM
LOL - yeah, CSW can be a bit..................strange.

Actually,  I think you will find that there is no difference, and that its actually not a 3rd edition as such, just a 3rd printing, and it is the same as the '1st' edition'.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 16, 2019, 05:44:39 PM
I don't think CONSIM has changed their format since the days of the 1200-baud modem.  ;D
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 16, 2019, 07:03:46 PM
I don't think CONSIM has changed their format since the days of the 1200-baud modem.  ;D

I actually have one of those for my C128. I wonder if I could surf CSW with it. Hmmm... anyone known a good dial-up ISP?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bbmike on September 16, 2019, 07:17:01 PM
Netscape Navigator.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 16, 2019, 07:29:43 PM
Too fancy.  :(
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: trailrunner on September 16, 2019, 08:39:22 PM
I don't think CONSIM has changed their format since the days of the 1200-baud modem.  ;D

I actually have one of those for my C128. I wonder if I could surf CSW with it. Hmmm... anyone known a good dial-up ISP?

I think I have some AOL CDs around here somewhere.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 17, 2019, 03:52:36 AM
LOL - yeah, CSW can be a bit..................strange.

Actually,  I think you will find that there is no difference, and that its actually not a 3rd edition as such, just a 3rd printing, and it is the same as the '1st' edition'.
That is indeed worth knowing - thanks.

I was making assumptions on other games where later editions were better - mounted boards, clearer rule set, errata being in the manual as opposed to being additions.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 17, 2019, 06:04:27 AM
In this case, its a 3rd printing, and not a 3rd edition. You can also get a mounted map for it - cost extra, of course  ;)
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bbmike on September 17, 2019, 08:17:16 AM
I don't think CONSIM has changed their format since the days of the 1200-baud modem.  ;D

I actually have one of those for my C128. I wonder if I could surf CSW with it. Hmmm... anyone known a good dial-up ISP?

I think I have some AOL CDs around here somewhere.

If you can't find them there's billions in the landfills around the nation.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 17, 2019, 10:24:29 PM
their shiny sides are also good for scaring away woodpeckers from your house if you string them up in a mobile.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 18, 2019, 05:30:24 AM
..European or African woodpeckers?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 18, 2019, 09:45:18 AM
Are you suggesting AOL CDs migrate?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 18, 2019, 06:51:13 PM
Only if unladen
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 23, 2019, 01:57:33 AM
I am so very confused with the rules in this game. I'm only at page 9 - Combat Modifiers.

The first section of those rules are about halving attack values and doubling defense values and rounding up. First off, the only part up to this point in the rules at the moment about halving attack values and doubling defence values are that are when attacking across an intact bridge. It seems performing a river crossing/assault does not encompass this halving and doubling rule - is that correct?

Second, after the First section on Combat Modifiers, the section talks about only the first unit (Lead Formation) being able to attack at full value and the rest fighting at half their printed value. So are they halved again?

Honestly, reading these rules is going to make going back to LnL a doddle.  :D

I really, really, really want to like this game and get it on the board...I'm currently reading a book on Op Market Garden...but the rules!! I haven't even gotten to the armour shift part yet.

Bob - you've played this game. If you have any ideas on how to read the rules and get them to stay in my head and make sense, I'm all ears.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 23, 2019, 05:22:34 AM
Its not the easiest system to master, but what I found was that there are examples of play in the rule book which are a big help - just go through then carefully, it all does make sense. Also worth looking at the BGG forum, as that can help to answer some questions.

I'm deep into the Horse & Musket games at the moment, but I will dig out the rules and go through them again as it been a while since I played. I will try and assist you if I can.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 23, 2019, 05:40:25 AM
Don't go mixing up rulesets...it could be awful messy when you get to a game of Horse and Musket.

Going to the example is exactly what I was looking for. I'll go through the example then the rules - perhaps seeing them in action and then seeing the rule could help.

Thank you
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Barthheart on September 23, 2019, 05:58:05 AM
Play along with the play though that starts on page 26. I mean actual setup the game and move the pieces and follow the combats exactly as in the play through for the first couple of turns.
Doing this and reading the rules helped me.
Also the summary of rules on page 35-36 and the sequence of play on the back cover of the rule book help when you need to look stuff up.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 23, 2019, 06:08:43 AM
Yep, that is good advice. There are also some youtube vids which you may find helpful.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: tuna on September 23, 2019, 06:53:06 AM
lol. I still haven't opened it yet, this was a very busy weekend. I did download some program some guy wrote last week, that shows how the battle should resolve? I think that might help demonstrate what is going on too.. Thanks for all the suggestions.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 23, 2019, 09:47:51 AM
Play along with the play though that starts on page 26. I mean actual setup the game and move the pieces and follow the combats exactly as in the play through for the first couple of turns.
Doing this and reading the rules helped me.
Also the summary of rules on page 35-36 and the sequence of play on the back cover of the rule book help when you need to look stuff up.
I will do exactly this. Thanks
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 23, 2019, 09:50:51 AM
Yep, that is good advice. There are also some youtube vids which you may find helpful.
I did link to one in this thread - but I haven't actually got round to it yet. I thought I'd read the manual first but as that isn't working out great, I will look them up again.

It's not that the manual is confusing. On the contrary it's laid out very well so far - but there are some rather complicated mechanics in this game I've never come across before.

I really want to learn it though because the mechanics are similar to the other games in the line and I'd really like to play those also.

I need to hurry up too because Storming the Gap will be here before I know it.  :ROFL:
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 28, 2019, 04:28:58 AM
I haven't watched this yet, but it's in my list. Maybe it'll help



Jesus...I've just watched this guy for 5 minutes and he lost 3 bridges that he approached (rolls of 6 each time!!) Unlucky or what.
Actually looking at the rules, it's incredibly easy to blow the bridges...almost a given. Die rolls above 2 will blow a bridge. For some reason I thought it wouldn't be so easy...I guess after watching the film and seeing so few blown.

The only modifier is -1 on the first turn. I guess that makes it imperative to try and capture the bridges on the 1st turn.

Also - in game, Arnhem, Nijmegen and Westervoort can never be blown. Oh - and Grave can't be blown on turn 1 - so get yer skates on!
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 28, 2019, 06:38:38 AM
I think you have to bear in mind that the Germans had prepared all these bridges for demolition well beforehand, and they all had guard detachments in place to do so once they were given the order.

If you want a good book on the subject, I would recommend 'A magnificent Disaster' by David Bennett.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 28, 2019, 02:17:02 PM
Yeah I think I'm proper screwed over by the movie. IIRC only the bridge at Grave (or was it Son) was blown

Thanks for the book tip. I've only read Cornelius Ryan and more recently Anthony Beevor
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 28, 2019, 02:29:16 PM
The Ryan book is rather dated now, but Beevor's book is good, as are all of his.

The book above takes advantage of more material that has been made available in recent years; another very good book on the subject is 'The Devils Birthday' by Geoffrey Powell, and another obvious one is 'A Drop Too Many' by Maj, Gen.John Frost.

For me, the big unsung hero of the battle was Stanislaw Sosabowski, commander of the Polish Brigade, he seems to have been one of the few people who really understood what was going on and what needed to be done. Its a great shame that his part, and that of his men was unjustly played down by the British Command, and he was even made a scapegoat.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 28, 2019, 03:23:22 PM
AFA Beevor goes, he has two Arnhem books listed at amazon:


Arnhem: The Battle for the Bridges, 1944 (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0670918660/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A22U6FDAII1DYF&psc=1):  by Anthony Beevor

and
 
The Battle of Arnhem: The Deadliest Airborne Operation of World War II (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0525429824/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1) by Antony Beevor

Are these the same book or did he write two separate ones?
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: mirth on September 28, 2019, 03:40:40 PM
UK/US versions of the same book.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 28, 2019, 04:00:08 PM
Thanks. I'll go for the nicest cheap hardback then... after double-checking my existing kindle library, just in case.  ;D
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 28, 2019, 04:22:57 PM
I love the Kindle and actually can't read a book unless it's on Kindle just due to don't size mostly.

The problem with Kindle though is pictures. Historical war books often have pictures (for example maps as in the Beevor book) but they don't show up great on the Kindle and so you do miss something quite significant
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: Staggerwing on September 28, 2019, 04:32:03 PM
I love the Kindle and actually can't read a book unless it's on Kindle just due to don't size mostly.

The problem with Kindle though is pictures. Historical war books often have pictures (for example maps as in the Beevor book) but they don't show up great on the Kindle and so you do miss something quite significant

For that kind of stuff (lots of maps, diagrams, photos, etc) using the kindle app on an iPad or other large tablet works well. You can zoom in and out as needed. If you had an e-reader already you could do both and reed the largest sections of text on the e-ink device and referent to the tablet as needed.

For books that only have a few big maps (such as say, the endpaper world maps in a fantasy novel) you could print those out ahead of time on some paper since most map images are readily available on Google somewhere. If you can't D/L the file then do a screen capture instead.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: BanzaiCat on September 29, 2019, 06:35:17 PM
Yeah, the Kindle Paperwhite is pretty poor with images/maps, but the Fire is nice.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: bob48 on September 30, 2019, 06:04:32 AM
Both me and Mrs B have had our Fire HD's for quite some time and use them a lot. Worth the price tag without doubt.
Title: Re: Finally bought my first Wargame today.
Post by: judgedredd on September 30, 2019, 07:20:11 AM
Kindle Fire is too heavy for comfortable reading imo. Great for images. Perhaps I should have it to hand so I can look at proper images though  :bigthumb: